Sindragosa reflection

[corca]

Logs for last night aren't up yet, but I still have the logs from our original kill and my memory and here are a few thoughts:

Unchained magics (first kill):
http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/7s0qb2ic5rnf5g8b/spell/69762/?s=6554&e=7113#tab-debuffs
One thing to note is that we had 13 eligible targets that night (I'm pretty sure tonight we only had 12). We could probably try to stack a few more casters for this fight to reduce the healer burden.

Additional note: Magic-wielding melee (Retadins, Enh shamen, DKs) and physical-dealing ranged (Hunters) don't appear eligible to soak this debuff.

Unchained magics (phase 2, first kill):
http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/7s0qb2ic5rnf5g8b/spell/69762/?s=6895&e=7114#tab-debuffs
Isolating the timeframe to just Phase2, we can see that the healers managed to take slightly below the expected number of Unchained magics. I guess this averages to having about 14 eligible targets.

Frost Beacon (phase 2, first kill):
http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/7s0qb2ic5rnf5g8b/spell/69762/?s=6554&e=7113#tab-debuffs
Looking at the Frost beacons for Phase 2, it seems that the healers did take slightly above the expected number of Frost Beacons that night. However, I also remember that at least one of our decent attempts last night was ruined by 5 healers in a row getting Frost beacon. This is just an RNG wipe I think we'll just have to accept.

[Feychanghao]

As far as Frost Tomb placements, I feel that some people were still confused about where to stand. Yes, they may know who goes where, but some people were still taking double damage from being too close to each other. I don't know if it's because they haven't read up on the fight, or just because they haven't had the experience yet. Either way, I'm sure that everyone in the raid checks the forums frequently, and I've posted a diagram of where each mark stands. Just because I'm an applicant doesn't mean that diagram is incorrect.

The times where Justus had Frost Beacon on him, while under the effects of Frost Breath, don't count. He was even unlucky enough to be marked as Skull and Moon. Sure, he could use Intervene to get to his spot, but I'm pretty sure he had to burn it to get to the stairs first, before marks went out. He's even called out for Blessing of Freedom, and I didn't notice it on him (I could be wrong).

We can solve this by having the other marks shift over. For example, if Justus is Skull, have X go to the far side. If Justus is Moon, have Square go Far. As far as using BoF, the Paladins won't have to worry about it, and it makes sure that Fiddle has a BoF ready for him after the Air Phase ends.

Yes, I know Frost Tombs during Phase 1 wasn't the primary cause of our wipes, but they played a huge part, in my opinion. People dying before the third Air Phase, or even before Phase 2, means less battle-rezzes for when a healer or tank dies, especially a tank.

[Brashara]

How does the game use mechanics to distinguish me from a retadin? For instance, if I were to get into melee range and swing at the boss a lot, would it give me both debuffs or not have to deal with the magic debuff? Is the same true for other healers? How does the debuff determine what you are?

[corca]

How does the game use mechanics to distinguish me from a retadin? For instance, if I were to get into melee range and swing at the boss a lot, would it give me both debuffs or not have to deal with the magic debuff? Is the same true for other healers? How does the debuff determine what you are?

No idea, it could be based on mana pool, talents, or how many non-retadin spells you cast.

[towelliee]

I was in melee healing only and judging for heals and i kept on with same debuff for melee

[Ripshawd]

Didn't Harle say that he received both debuffs in our first week of attempts? They may have changed it since then, so if ret paladins, enh shamans, etc. aren't getting the magic debuff now, it could be that the debuff only targets certain specializations. Maybe it's time for me to break out that dual-wielding enhancement healing spec I've been wanting to try... =D

[corca]

Didn't Harle say that he received both debuffs in our first week of attempts? They may have changed it since then, so if ret paladins, enh shamans, etc. aren't getting the magic debuff now, it could be that the debuff only targets certain specializations. Maybe it's time for me to break out that dual-wielding enhancement healing spec I've been wanting to try... =D

I went back and also checked the logs from the Sindragosa attempts two weeks ago, Harle didn't get Unchained magic in either:

Thu 2/4: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/ku6yi98elctho34f/spell/69762/?enc=bosses&boss=36853
Mon 2/8: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/06qyp7lhq7y10hm5/spell/69762/

He must have been mistaking it for some other debuff.

Today I'm going to try various combinations of tricks during phase 1 (since healing then isn't an issue):
1) Standing with the melee
2) Wanding/autoattack every few heals
3) Not casting at all

If we know the criteria, maybe we can find a way to make sure we don't get the debuff when it counts. For instance, I can imagine a strategy where we just have two healers cast nothing during phase 1, if it means they never get the debuff in phase 2.

Your off-spec healing tricks are also in the realm of possibility. Have they nerfed protadin pvp healing yet?

[Ripshawd]

Since I cant raid with yall, I'll spend some time looking up builds and gear that would be able to utilize cross-spec healing for shamans. If only I could find a one-hand weapon with spellpower...

[corca]

I'm reading on the forums that it Unchained magic will always pick 3 healers and 3 dps. If this is the case, then bringing more casters won't actually help the situation...

...unless we can somehow trick the game into thinking that some of our dps are really healers! For example, if we make Whitenoise/Jin/Hilo/Kalani heal for like the first minute, will the game then bucket them with the healers for the rest of the fight?

[Ripshawd]

It's worth a try. The disadvantage to this is that we lock out a select number of our dps more frequently. Is that worth it?

Also, if 3 of our healers always get locked out, we may need to be more flexible for phase 3... perhaps the 3 healers targeted are the first to refresh their stacks of Mystic Buffet, rather than dividing our healers into two groups.

What may seem like an RNG element that cannot be overcome may just be another factor of the fight that we have to figure out and conquer.

[corca]

Yeah, I think you new hiding rule is the right one.

In other news, standing in melee and doing nothing but wanding doesn't trick the game. :(

[jiN]

I'm reading on the forums that it Unchained magic will always pick 3 healers and 3 dps. If this is the case, then bringing more casters won't actually help the situation...

...unless we can somehow trick the game into thinking that some of our dps are really healers! For example, if we make Whitenoise/Jin/Hilo/Kalani heal for like the first minute, will the game then bucket them with the healers for the rest of the fight?

Maybe it picks the healers based on threat level?

[Brashara]

I'm starting to think its based on talents. Anyone wanna check this out in a 10-m? Preferably a priest with a shadow spec.